Looking Into The World Within Ourselves

The Most Important Conversations | World Within

We often identify with our physical body, but our entire identity must not solely depend on this very external element. Understanding the world within is key to knowing and revealing our most authentic self, untethered to earthly forces out of our control. In this conversation, Chad Lefevre and September Dorhmann discuss how to know oneself not from the body alone, which is directly impacted by the machinations of society, but the one deep within that’s only accessible to you. They explain how getting in touch with this inner depth allows you to unlock a deep level of self-trust, harness the power of intention, and realize the mind-boggling impact of time bending.

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Looking Into The World Within Ourselves

I’ve got September Dohrmann here with me as usual. September, how are you doing?

Doing great. Had a wonderful meditation this morning. I had the awareness of when I’m being present from the inside of me or when I’m being present externally. Does that make sense?

Meditation Experiences

Yes, we’ve talked about this before in the Whole Life Architecture program, and in some of the work about TMIC, I’ve referenced Ram Dass’s metaphor where he says, “We’re all wearing a space suit and we all identify with the space suit versus identifying with who we really are.” In other words, who’s in the space suit, and who’s operating the space suit? Tell me more about your experience. You started to have an experience in meditation where you felt you were in the spacesuit or outside looking and observing the spacesuit.

I became aware of the contrast between the two. I felt myself when my energy was outside my body and then I felt myself and spent a lot of time with being on the inside, feeling my energy on the inside. It’s the me of me, the one that’s doing the thinking that’s behind the thinking the light being is what Bernie used to call, “Part of us.”“We’re orbs of light when we get to the other side.” That’s what he used to say.

I really don’t have a way of explaining what that is because the fact is I don’t know for sure what happens when we leave this body or leave this dimension but it was really interesting because when I was sitting in the space of having my energy from within, I also had the awareness that I love to connect with source energy when I’m in meditation and I normally do it outside.

Connecting outside with source energy, but this time I chose to connect with source energy from the inside. What that felt like to me is we read in a lot of religious texts that you are an expression of God, you are God’s energy. You’re just the September Dohrmann expression of that energy or the Chad Lefevre expression of the same source energy. I was feeling into that and sitting with how unlimited that energy is. When I sat in that space, I became aware of my body suit limitations, the mind limitations. “Wow, source energy is so unlimited.”

There are no boundaries around it but when we look at it through our human body suit lens, there are so many different boundaries that we put around our belief system, what we believe is possible, and who we are. We limit ourselves. That huge awareness this morning was the limitation that I’ve placed on myself by not living from the place of source energy. It ties into being present in the now, to this moment right here.

That’s right. First of all, that’s a super cool experience. Is that the first time you’ve had that awareness?

This is the deepest I’ve gone with the awareness. I really sat in that space. I almost felt disconnected from my body. I was so into my me of me, into that energy of me, the consciousness of me. I’ve had some pretty wild experiences in meditation and profound awareness.

Meditation is one of these peak flow experiences that we can drop into. Now, just as everyone knows who’s reading, I’m in Bali, Indonesia, which is where I will be for the next couple of months, and what we’ve been doing since we’ve been here, it’s a very mystical place. Mystical in the sense that anyone who’s been here knows this, but you walk down the street and they’re burning incense and flowers literally on the sidewalk.

You have to walk over the incense and the flowers that are burning in the sidewalk and it’s many meters or whatever. It’s you think of storefronts and then in front of the storefronts, they’ll have this little pile of burning flowers and incense. Then there are temples everywhere and we’ve been doing yoga every night, yoga, meditation every night before bed.

I bring that up only because there are places you can go in the world that make it easier for you to drop into the experience that you’re talking about but any type of meditation, if you do it long enough, and this is the thing that I find this is the deepest you’ve ever felt it. What have we been doing for the last six months is consistent daily meditation.

It opens you up to the energy within, as opposed to focusing on the energy without. What the experience you’re describing has been, like you mentioned, written about in various ways through, several spiritual, religious, and even philosophical texts throughout history. That’s a profound experience.

The thing that always gets written about is that we are not the spacesuit. We are not the body. Yet so many of us in our life relate all of life and our relationships and experiences to it as the body of who I am, but no, who is in the body observing the body. This is the thing that you wouldn’t know you had a body if you were just the body.

Like the fish in the fish bowl. If you went to the fish and you said, “How’s the water today?” If the fish has become so identified with the water that it says, “What water?” It’s just all-encompassing. It’s swimming in now. Our actual being ends up swimming in the water of our body, and we start to conflate and confuse that we are the body. Now the body is an access point to the self. So the body’s not unimportant, but it’s not who we are.

The ego is the proclivity of human beings to identify with their ego, which is their identity, we talk about this in Emotional Sobriety, that one of the issues in the world today is that it’s exactly what you’re talking about and what you had the experience of disassociating. You disassociated in meditation with the body and became the observer of the body. Again, I just want to go back to what I said a minute ago. You would not know you had a body if you were the body. There’s evidence that you’re not your body because you’re observing the body. Who is the observer?

Yes, that. Last night, you and I were talking about time and the vagus nerve and how all that ties in together. I recalled that conversation in meditation because I was so relaxed, so calm. When I looked at the various situations that are going on in my life, there was zero emotion connected to it but that’s being inside and being present to the now. You’re only in the moment. You’re not projecting anything and in work, we’re projecting, we’re outside, we’re processing something.

We’re thinking about this, we’re organizing that we’re making sense of this here, we’re writing copy here, it’s all external to some degree. I think there is, however, the flow state. When you’re in the flow, you just completely lose your sense of time and completely lose the sense of your body suit. You lose touch with it and you’re just in this state of flow. You’re in a flow of consciousness, a flow of energy. It’s still new, and this experience is new. I’m still processing what it all means and does it mean anything? Should I not be interpreting? Am I overthinking it?

Interestingly enough, it means nothing because associating and attaching meaning to things is also a body-based outer-focused way of living. I love it. Ram Dass’s film that they made before he passed away. It’s on iTunes. If anyone wants to watch it, it’s called Becoming Nobody. Nobody is how it’s spelled the combined words, but break it up becoming no, body. You are somebody, you are a body or you are no body. Meaning, what are you identifying with?

Yes, and there was a sense of feeling everything and nothing all at once. It was blissful. I just wanted to stay there all day. It felt so lovely to be and energetically suspended is what it felt.

Authentic Self

You were you were experiencing your authentic self. Romana Maharshi talks about the self as being the authentic you and as you said, all of these different spiritual texts throughout the world, that depending on the religious tradition or spiritual tradition, you believe it’ll say something like we are God, or it’ll say something like in the Christian Bible, God made man in his image which is just a metaphorical way of saying that God’s spirit, God’s energy is in us.

Of course, because the creator, the universe, God, whatever you want to call that force, consciousness, whatever, it goes by many different names, is in all living things because it is the creator of all things. God is in us, with us, we move with God. It’s not the anthropomorphic man in the sky on the throne. I don’t believe it.

That is external to us because consider this, for something to be external to us, you have to be a somebody a some, body because if you’re a body The way you relate to the world is there’s me my body and there’s what’s not me, not my body. My relationship is my body to what’s not my body. Other people are not my body. The nature is not my body.

Anything that’s a phenomenological experience outside of the self, which Ramana Maharshi calls the essence of who you authentically are, the self, versus he says the I, which the I would be the ego in Freud’s language. It gets confusing sometimes for people because the concept’s the same but we use different words.

Freud might call the ego that personified, the identified thing that we relate to as identity. Ramana Maharshi would call it the I and so forth. There are different words for the same principle and the same concept. I’m trying to get to the heart of the principle here, which is that you’re either living from the world within or the world without. Most of us are living in a world without. When we’re living in a world without, we are identified with the body. We are somebody.

When Ram Dass said to become nobody, he meant to have no identification with the body. What does that mean? It means don’t identify with your phenomenological experience or phenomenon. Don’t identify with what you taste, smell, see, hear, touch. Not that those things are important. See, it’s almost like we’re a consciousness or a soul or an entity that has been given this spacesuit, this machine.

Don’t identify with what you taste, smell, see, hear, or touch. Those things are not important. What matters is our consciousness and soul, not this spacesuit of a body.

Have you ever seen those movies? I think one was called Pacific Rim and the human beings got inside these massive robot things that they could control and had legs and arms and they could walk into the Pacific Ocean and there was about a war or something. I can’t remember the plot anymore, but basically, they would get inside of these things and drive them. Now that’s what’s going on with us.

Our soul has got inside this body and is sitting in the driver’s seat, pulling all the levers. What happens is, from a very young age, we’re told over and over again that people aren’t relating to the self or the eye, they’re relating to the machine we’re driving. They’re lauding the machine, they’re congratulating the machine, they’re telling the machine how to behave.

Eventually, and this is no different, I was reading a story yesterday about a man somewhere in the United States, I can’t remember which state, he was just released from prison, he was in prison for 20 years for a crime, a murder that he didn’t commit. They found that he actually didn’t commit the murder but here’s the thing. He was in prison because he confessed to the murder.

When they went back and watched the tapes of the police and staff who were interrogating him around the time of the murder, they found that he was so heavily accosted, not physically, but in terms of the accusations. This is what the mind will do to remove the pain of the situation. He was able to convince himself, listening to these other people, “I must have done it.”

I remember sitting there last night thinking, if I didn’t murder someone, this is what I’m thinking, you could never convince me I did it. How could you convince me that I murdered someone? This is what’s going through my mind but then I have a moment of humility and I ask myself, this man is no better than me.

Something in that experience caused him to release his experience of reality and adopt another’s as his own. In this case, the projected narrative that the police were telling him and he thought, “Maybe I’m crazy. Maybe I did kill that person.” He ended up confessing. Now why would the brain do that? To remove him from the pain of the interrogation, which got so immense and intense that it was worth it to him to go to prison than continue to be in that moment.

Now, this is how plastic the brain is. I want everyone to just think about this. If you didn’t murder someone and you could be convinced that you did, you could be convinced of anything. From a very young age, we have been told you are the body. This is all that matters. The body, the body, the body. The phenomenological world without. This is reality. This is what matters. Forget everything you know. Forget who you think you are. You have to go to school. You have to get a job. You have to pay the bills and then you die. The taxman takes it all and that’s it.

This is what this life is about. That’s it, you’ve been told that. It’s been modeled to us. It’s been told to us. It’s been reinforced to us. It’s been incentivized to us. We are led down this path and I’m not making money or living a good, wealthy, abundant life. Wrong. When we identify with that as the reason for our existence and are willing to do anything to get it because we’re so desperate because we’ve been convinced that we are the body and that this thing must be preserved at all costs. Even admitting to committing a murder I didn’t do. That’s what we’re dealing with here in the head.

The machine has taken over. Pink Floyd wrote a song in 1977, I think it was, from the album, Wish You Were Here, called Welcome to the Machine. Now it’s a metaphor. You could think of it as the machine of society. You could think of it as the machine of our mind. You could think of it as the machine of the body. The point is it’s a machine that’s controlling you, not you. Who’s the you? Who is the self? Who is the I?

We have a mental health crisis happening in the country and bubbling up around the world because we have mind-fucked ourselves, quite frankly, to believe that the only thing that matters is the world without the body winning at the game. Right now, and with the social media craze that’s been going on for 14 or 15 years now, it’s all an outer-world projection.

Energy Balance And Time Bending

It’s like, look at me, but they’re not seeing you. They’re seeing the body. They’re seeing the life. They’re seeing this artificial construction that you’ve created, but it’s not you. I could keep going on but I mean, this is what we’re talking about. When you were in meditation, and I was sharing with you, when I was in meditation the other night, I was in this pose that is intentionally designed to stimulate the vagus nerve.

The vagus nerve turns on the parasympathetic nervous system and allows us to relax. I was in a pose that triggered that. Many poses in yoga can do that and I was in it, I was doing a yin practice. Yin is the feminine energy in the yoga language. Yang is a masculine or more active energy in the yoga language. I was in a yin or feminine practice, which is about going into and deepening into postures and holding those postures for a time and not reacting to the muscle that will spasm. Oftentimes it’s uncomfortable and can be painful, but you press in and you breathe through the discomfort and you settle into this comfort and you accept. It’s about accepting.

See, the feminine is all about accepting, receiving, and being with. This is why we need to make a shift in the world right now towards a more feminine way of being. If the yang energy of society, which is the more masculine, not making masculinity wrong, but too much of one thing out of balance is never a good thing.

We have developed a world over many years now, decades, millennia, where masculine energy has been the dominating energy. What’s happened is that’s created a world that we can’t accept. We can’t be with it. Mental health crisis, health, dis-ease, all of this stuff starts to bubble up. I was in that practice, in the Yin practice, laying back, stimulating the vagus nerve, and was supposed to be there for 10 minutes, I’m laying there, and I feel perceptually only a minute has gone by.

Then the yoga teacher says, “It’s time to come out of the pose.” That means 10 minutes went by, I thought I just started. Even our perception of time is connected to the body. When we extricate ourselves from the body, when we’re no longer body-centric I’m not saying we necessarily leave the body like in some astral traveling thing or something. Some people believe that’s true. I don’t know. It’s never happened to me.

I’m not saying we leave the body, but our perception of time gets skewed. The way we relate to time is also body-centric, or it doesn’t have to be. Remember when you were a child, and it seemed like summer would go on forever? It just seemed it would go forever, right? It’s the same amount of time. Now it seems it just goes like this. Life goes like this the older you get. Its time isn’t speeding up. It’s perception. The only thing that’s shifted. We covered a lot of ground.

Yes. We talked about how that relaxed state affects time and we hear the saying, “Time flies when you’re having fun.” You’re in a relaxed state and the same thing with being in a relaxed state, it’s like a time-bending superpower. I had to go pick up somebody from the bus station. Traffic was horrible in Tampa and we had to get them there on time.

There was no way. Looking at the interstate, pulling up GPS, showing us, how the delays were, there was an accident, there was construction, it was horrible. I asked him, his name is Jacques, I said, “Jacques, do you know how to time bend?” He’s, “Absolutely, I do.” We got there 30 minutes before he had to be there.

I can say that anytime I’ve needed to be somewhere on time, and I was so stressed out about it, I would just tell myself, just relax, you’ll get there at the right and perfect time. Just relax, just relax. It’s the relaxing, the state of relaxation around time that seems to bend time. I think when you were talking about the vagus nerve and how it interferes with that, being in a relaxed state, we have no concept of time in that space. What are your thoughts on time bending?

If you are stressed about getting somewhere on time, just relax. Being in a state of relaxation seems to bend time.

I think what we call time-bending, so time is time. Our way that we relate to time is, if anyone’s seen that phenomenal movie, Interstellar, it does a great job of articulating how time works. Time is not constant, it’s relative. We know this, time is relative. You could be around a black hole and time is going to do something very different there than it will on planet Earth or wherever you travel in the universe. In the movie, he went to another planet.

Because of the way time worked on that planet, for those of you who haven’t seen the movie, phenomenal movie, my favorite movie of all time, still to this day. Anyway, he goes down to this planet and they have to pick up another crew that’s down there. The whole narrative of the story is Matthew McConaughey’s trying to get back.

They’re trying to find an alternative to Earth and the families are still on Earth, hoping, praying, waiting, and that they find an alternative and that they find a way to transport humanity to another planet so humanity can survive. Anyway, he’s part of the ship. He goes out there and they go to this one planet that another ship had gone to and they lost contact with.

They went to try to rescue them and he had this conundrum because they said if you go down to this planet even if we’re there for only 10 minutes, 20 years on Earth’s time will go by. He thought to himself, “Oh my gosh, my daughter’s going to be 20 years older when I’m down there only 10 minutes. What do I do? Do I go down and save these people?” These conundrums.

Time is relative. We know that from Einstein’s theory and the other work that’s been done in that space. Time bending, I don’t know if it’s that we bend time or if it’s that we can alter our perception of time and therefore alter our experience of time. I’m not going to say one way or another because what I know about this life is everything we thought was impossible always seems to show up as possible at some point.

It may be a different conversation and exploration but what I do know is that we can alter time. Our experience of time. When I was in the yoga pose, 10 minutes had gone by, and my perception was one minute had gone by. On that same scale, if I perceive one year has gone by, I could be in that relaxed state, yet 10 years could have gone by. You could just magnify it out.

I like that. How we perceive time and it’s more about how we’re experiencing time. In my example where I had to take Jacques to the bus station by a certain time, I thought for sure, and even GPS showed that we’d be 15 minutes late, which means he’s going to miss whatever departure time. We had no choice, we had to try, we had to try to make it.

My son’s high school graduation, we thought it was 06:00 PM It was 06:00 AM and we woke up at 06:00 with Daniel, my oldest son screaming in the house, “Graduation has started, graduation has started.” Now we’re up in Tarpon Springs, graduation was down in St. Pete and it was during rush hour traffic, 06:00. We all just get up and leave.

Daniel says, “There’s no way, we’re not going to make it. We’re not going to make it.” I said, “Daniel, you have to just try. Even if you don’t make it, you got to put in the effort, cause anything could happen.” We got there at the perfect time. They were just starting to call the students. They had all the announcements and all the speeches and all the stuff that took place. We got there right on time for him to sit there and be called in line at the right and perfect timing.

I think about that, how from one angle it seems so bizarre that we would make it down to St. Pete in morning rush hour traffic, which is a good hour and 15 minutes away from Tarpon Springs at that time when traffic was, it’s how long it took us to get down to St. Pete, even an hour and a half. We got there and I don’t even know what time, I didn’t even look at the time. All that mattered was that we were there at the right and perfect time. That is also one of those experiences that’s difficult to explain looking back. How did that happen?

Power Of Intention

I think you know the answer is that we teach it throughout the whole life of architecture. What you’re talking about is the power of intention. Remember, whatever you believe, you’re right. Whatever we believe, we will find evidence in our experience. What the world is grappling with right now, especially in the post-COVID period and everything that’s gone down, is there is an argument in the social media sphere in the information sphere, it’s about different perceptions of reality going on. That’s really what this is.

It comes from ego because whenever you’re arguing, you’re coming from ego anyway. Identity, it’s preserving. The spacesuit, coming back to where we started today. Spacesuits are arguing because your true self, our true self is out of time. It doesn’t exist in that construct. That construct, our body suits relates to time because our body suits have an expiry date. They will die.

If you’re living in a world without, you are hyper-attentive to the expiry date of your body. That doesn’t mean don’t take care of your spacesuit. Keep it clean, wash it, fix the helmet, and things like that. Take care of it. It’s the temple of your soul in a sense. We’re driving around in this thing. Anyway, coming back to your story, and all of this mashes up, we could do podcasts on 10 different things from what we’ve talked about, just drilling in on any of this.

We do drill into all of this stuff in the whole life architecture world so that you who are reading can re-architect your life by design instead of living and tolerating a life by default, which all of us have done and will continue to do until we make a different choice. The world right now is in an argument about so-called facts, whatever you believe though you’re right about.

Facts are a social construction, a thing we agreed to agree on. There have been many facts throughout human history that have been, “Proven wrong.” They weren’t facts. If they were truly a fact, you couldn’t prove it wrong because it’s a fact, right? There’s nothing that’s a fact because everything is going to find at the very least nuance or at most be found to be the opposite and yet the other thing I can say is that anything you believe is a fact, I can show you a situation that has occurred somewhere in the world either in this time or another time, where the exact opposite has also been true.

This is where the paradigms and paradox conversation comes in, we’re always in a paradigm, which is a worldview, a belief system, we’re always in one, the question is, have you designed it or are you just reacting to the one you found yourself in? The paradigms and paradox conversation come into here. Intentionality comes in here.

Your intention was to get to your son’s graduation, and you believed it was possible. Therefore, your perception of what was required was altered and you made it so. I’ll give you an example from my own life that’s similar to yours. I was in LA. This is going back almost 12 years, something like that. I never missed my daughter’s birthday and I wasn’t intending to miss my daughter’s birthday.

A friend is driving me to the airport. I’m leaving that day. I had to fly back home to where she was living and we got stuck on the 405, which as everyone knows, is a beast. I said, “Let’s take one of the side roads.” We took one of the side roads, we went to Lincoln Boulevard, and Lincoln is usually not that bad. It’s busy, but not like the 405.

We’re driving up Lincoln, and it just happens there’s a ton of construction, and it’s all crunched to one lane, and it’s worse than the 405. In normal traffic, I was only 20 minutes from the airport. It took us about an hour and a half to get to the airport. That made me late for my plane and by the time we arrived at LAX, my flight was leaving in 20 minutes.

Now, anyone who’s traveled since 9-11 knows that if you’re not there, checked in, bags, everything at a minimum, usually 30 to 45 minutes before the flight because you have to go through security and they got to get the bags to the plane, all this stuff, you’re not getting on that plane. It’s just not going to happen. I intended to not miss my daughter’s birthday party and I just centered myself in the car and said, “I will get on that plane today.”

I didn’t know how, but here’s how this works. When you determine you’re going to make something happen, everything starts to shift. It’s not magic, but when you think, “We’re doing this.” Your brain shifts gears and starts thinking, “How can I make this work?” “How can I make this happen?” When you’re saying it’s never going to work or when you’re saying I’m not going to make it, your brain starts finding evidence for it to be the case because whatever you believe, you’re right.

The brain, the ego, and identity always need to be right. It’s a security thing. If we feel like our beliefs and reality are out of alignment, that causes immense stress because it’s seen as a security risk for the brain. Something is happening that I can’t control. Something is happening I can’t predict. Now we feel stress. The cortisol levels start rising, all of this stuff. Consider that our stress is 100% perceptual, created by perception.

Your son had stress, he wasn’t going to make it. You had no stress, we’re going to make it. Perception, same car, same location, leaving at the same time, two different experiences. I’m in the car going to LAX, my friend lets me get out when I get there, and I determined, I was getting on that plane, I walked in.

I walked right up to the woman at the counter, and she greeted me with a smile before she even got to go into the, “Can I get your ticket?” and all this stuff. I said, “Listen, I know I’m late for my plane. I know you’re not supposed to let me on that plane but here’s what I also know. It’s my daughter’s birthday today. I’ve never missed it and I know you have the power to make sure I don’t miss her birthday party. What can we do?”

She said, “Give me a second.” She started clicking away, typing, typing, typing. Talked to someone, and came back, “Okay, sir, I’m going to walk you through security. We’re going to walk your bags onto the plane and you’re going to make the flight.” Post 9-11 world. What was different? The only different thing was that I didn’t accept the reality that I couldn’t get on the plane. You were accepting the reality that you were not going to make it.

That boy is going to graduate. I’m not going to let him miss his graduation. He is getting to graduation. I am determined.

That’s it. You had emotion behind it. You had a purpose. You had intentionality.

I had a knowing that it would happen. Didn’t know how, but there was almost a knowing in there. It’s going to happen.

That’s because you decided it. I decided I was making it to the birthday party. You decided you were making the graduation. Everyone who’s reading, consider how often you accept what you consider to be inevitable, but if you actually could develop that sense of knowing that self-trust and do the work to alter your perception of what’s possible. How much more rich would your life be?

If you develop your sense of self-trust, you can alter your perception of what’s possible and how rich life can be.

How less fatiguing it would be. Going back to where I started in meditation when I would fill my energy outside my body, fill my energy inside my body, fill my energy outside my body, and fill it inside. I would do this back and forth. What’s the contrast? What’s the difference here? Outside, it feels fatiguing and a little staticky. When I’m inside, it’s so calm, relaxing, peaceful, and certain. Even though there’s all kinds of uncertainty, there’s still a level of certainty, I’m okay. No matter what, I’m okay. It’s not a mental game, it was a fact for me in being inside my body and being in the moment.

External Circumstances

It has to come from within too. That’s where the development of self-trust and we deal with all this stuff in the Whole Life Architecture program, as you move through you start to realize that, if we are accepting our life as it is, I don’t mean accept in the, there are things to accept and there are things not to accept. Things will happen that are outside of our control in life, and the only thing we can do in those moments is relax and accept that we don’t control all the variables.

What we do control is who we’re being about it. In the case of our two examples, we were not outer-focused. I couldn’t change the traffic. Let’s put it that way. The traffic was the traffic. That’s not something I was trying to control but you see in life, we try to control the outer stuff. What I was controlling, what you were controlling was who we were being and the inner stuff.

When I controlled that, when I said, no, I’m getting on the plane, I just don’t know how because I can’t control all the variables. Here’s the last little bit I want to say, and then we’ll leave it for another session. Obviously, there was going to be some variable I was going to need to influence or control because my spacesuit needed to get on a plane.

That had to happen. I was not like Star Trek where I could beam to my daughter’s birthday but when I was sitting in his car, it wasn’t present to me at the moment what that variable was going to be that I was going to be able to control or to influence. I didn’t know what it was, but because I had centered my mind and my intention that I was getting there, my mind started looking for solutions because that’s what it does.

Instead of trying to wrestle with the things we can’t control, believe, trust yourself, have an intention that anything is possible, and be open to what it is that you desire to create in your life. What that does is it moves your brain from finding all the evidence of why something’s not going to happen and it starts looking at why something is going to happen. You start looking for solutions. It wasn’t until I got out of the car and started walking to the ticket counter that my brain clicked in.

The only variable I can influence to make this happen is the conversation I’m going to have with the ticketing agent and the conversation she’s going to have with the security people. That’s it. That’s my end. I wasn’t even thinking that till I pulled up to the airport. If I had determined it was impossible to get on that plane, I would not have seen that as a possibility. I would just accept that I’m not going to make the party. Perception’s reality.

Yes, and with that, it’s the external things that don’t matter if you’re coming from that place. They’re there, they’re doing what they’re doing. It doesn’t mean it has to affect what we’re doing, where we’re coming from, or the outcome that we desire necessarily. Some external circumstances may throw in a challenge that we need to overcome.

Sure, but then the question in that case, again, it’s all perception. Did we need that thing anyway?

It’s not the problem. It’s how we react or respond to the problem that becomes a problem or not.

The Most Important Conversations | World Within

It’s how we respond when we react. We never get anywhere.

You can get to a place of habitually reacting from a place of response, can’t you?

It’s another reaction. It’s not a response because a response always requires intentionality, presence, and consciousness. If it goes into unconscious habituation, you’re in reaction now. Reaction is never response. They’re never the same thing. Responses become reactions.

Even if your reaction to something is to go inward and be still.

What if you’re not? The definition of being a reaction of being in a reactive state is you’re no longer present and conscious and in the driver’s seat of the robot, of the self. It is thinking of you, and then you react. I used to do karate before I started traveling so much and it was hard to pin down a regular karate regime, we used to go in and we used to do these routine moves over and again.

Now, the first few times I was ever doing those moves, I hadn’t built up muscle memory. I hadn’t built up any reaction. You may even talk about reaction time, in terms of being able to kick and punch if someone were to attack you or you were in a situation. The first time I’m learning it, it’s all responsive because I’m intentional, I’m conscious, I’m present, I’m doing something that’s not normal for me. It hasn’t been habituated yet.

I’m present for every kick and every little muscle tweak. How much energy this is taking? How hard and when are we done? We’ve been kicking for 20 minutes doing the same thing. Why do we have to? I’m mind shattered. I’m very present. Then after you do it for months and months and months, you just get in and you’re just reacting. I’m no longer present. I’m thinking about what I’m making for dinner that night and I’m going through 30 minutes of routine kicks.

Things that were a response can become a reaction. Everything actually that we have in our life that is a reaction for us at one point would have been a response but then we just do it so much, it becomes unconscious and habituated. That’s the only distinction between response and reaction. A reaction is unconscious and habituated and a response is conscious and intentional.

Reaction is unconscious and habituated, while a response is conscious and intentional.

We’re dealing with conscious and intentional in terms of responses or unconscious and habituated in terms of reactions. The problem with reactions is that the circumstances aren’t always the same and yet our brain is looking to model it is the same. It wants to react because it uses less energy. It’s predictable. It knows what to do, but you don’t always get the same outcome.

That’s why coming back to what you were saying earlier about when you were in meditation, as we wrap up, it’s been a good long session, but there’s so much meat in this. It’s just when you were talking about having that sense that you were out of body, the order you were in, you left your body, but you were observing it. There’s the world within and the world without.

When we are coming from, when we are a response, the body is not thinking of us and driving us. That’s what it would be if it was a reaction. But when we’re responding and we’re bringing intentionality to it, we are present for every little nuanced step of the way. It’s like women or men driving cars, guys eating a cheeseburger, driving with their hand on the phone, women doing the mascara.

This is a reaction, this is habituated. We want to be coming from a place of responding. We want to come from a place of intentionality. We want to come from the self, from within. Response requires that we come from within. Reaction is happy to be something that is coming from the world without. Reaction is only dealing with the surface stuff. It’s dealing with the form and not the substance.

Meditation Experiences II

When you’re coming from response, intentionality from within, unconditioned, you are dealing with the world within. You’re not just dealing with the form, you’re dealing with the substance. The substance is the I, the substance is the source, the substance is the self, who you really are. I think we’re going to have to break this up into several different micro-conversations because I could have gone down a billion little pathways off of that. I’m glad you had that experience with meditation.

It was nice to experience it at that level, to be able to play with the energy, put my energy out, put my energy in, and feel that. Bring my awareness to having my energy outside, what that feels, how I experience it, and what it feels to have my energy inside and experience that and sit with it. I just loved it. It was just really lovely.

You climbed outside your spacesuit.

I did. I climbed outside my spacesuit, but it was, I went inward. I didn’t go outward from the outside of my body. I went deep inside to the me of me. I disconnected from the body suit is what I would.

Know it’s like for those who’ve seen The Matrix. there’s the Matrix, which is the world without and then there’s the chair that Neo sits in where they have to plug him in so he can basically go into the Matrix. What you did is you took the plug out of your head. You got out of the chair and you went deeper in.

Yes. It felt like there was space between my physical body and the me of me. Like I was suspended. That’s what it felt like. I was suspended energetically. Floating into nothing, just floating.

That’s awesome. That happened this morning.

Yes, I didn’t feel my body sitting on the chair. I didn’t feel the chair. I didn’t feel my legs. I wasn’t feeling any of that. I was disconnected from it. It was very cool. It was very peaceful.

You were definitely not in your body then. If you weren’t feeling the chair, you were not in your body.

No. That was deep inside. It was a wonderful feeling. I think I’m going to practice that a little bit more because I said in the beginning, normally when I go to connect to source energy, I always go out and up to connect to sources where it sits for me. This time I went inside to tap into sources within me and that was really nice to feel that.

Just be careful of one thing though. Remember as the great sage for Star Wars fans has said, Yoda, which I think is pulled from Buddhist philosophy, “There is no try, there’s only do.” You don’t try to do this. You just do it. The distinction there is really powerful because when you try to do something, in the word try is effort. In meditation, there’s no effort, that’s actually effortlessness. If you start trying to recreate that moment, try to recreate it, you won’t. You’ll get attached to trying to recreate it, then you’ll get frustrated and then it becomes an even worse experience.

There is no effort in meditation. Do not try to do something. Focus on effortlessness.

Tomorrow I’m going to be in that space then.

Closing Words

Be in it, just drop into it. This is where the acceptance and the surrender come in. Everybody, thank you for joining us on this very interesting, deep, and long, but I hope it was engaging enough to keep you hanging out throughout the whole way of this episode of The Most Important Conversation. September and I will see you on our next episode. Thank you so much for joining us.

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